Dave's multi-floor South American adventure

[DaveB]

OK I am getting ready to start setting up all the basic plumbing. But I have no idea what the smartest way is to do this.

Diagram:

Here's what I don't know:

1) where to put a T in the tap water line for the tap drip into each tank. Basically how to split that so that it feeds
- 120 sump
- 220 tank
- RO filter

all properly without gravity / path of least resistance making all the water go to one disproportionately.

2) similarly, how to split the RO so it goes to both tanks. The RO will be above the sump so gravity will feed both. The 220 will demand a bit more per hour than the 120, though.

3) what size tube/pipe to use for all of this. PEX is what I want to do, but for ease of running through walls (mostly the hole sizes), the thinner the better.

4) where to put the chlorine/chloramine filters.

5) what the best way to do an emergency drain is. On the 220, I'm thinking a line that both FX5s drain from is fine... just not sure if that should be tied in to their little bottom spout, or from the pump return on a T, like in that older diagram above. Not really sure how I want to drain the 120 in an emergency. Either way I suppose that doesn't change the fact that that means I need to run another line from utility room to the 120, which means that's at least 5 separate pipes going through that hole in the wall.


I should note that I don't actually have the RO unit yet, and that would surely help me know a bit more about what size pipes to use.

I assume that if I am throttling the RO drip back to a few gph on two drip regulators, the RO filter is OK with that, right? And it'll only draw that much from the tap line? It won't end up having issues with the pressure from the amount of water that the tap line wants to send through it?

What flaws are there in my initial design?

 

[Clay]

Why are you using RO water again? It's a very difficult water to work with that is mostly void of minerals (99.9% pure). It has little buffering capability and most creatures don't do well with it.

Also, if you're going to go though the trouble of drilling the tank, might I suggest you look into building a sump instead or in addition to? It would provide you a great deal more ability to filter the tank efficiently. I've also never been a fan of drilling holes in a tank unnecessarily. It KILLS resale value, and it can be unsightly if you change your mind about filtration later. Holes are permanent, so think them out and be sure before you drill.

 

[DaveB]

I have extremely hard water from the tap and keep South Americans. I want to find a way to blend tap and RO in order to make them happier.

My tank is already drilled. The downstairs one can't have a sump because I need total silence in that room.

 

[Clay]

You can have a totally silent sump. It's a myth based on faulty plumbing designs that makes you think they can't be silent.
Example:
http://www.bostonreefers.org/forums/showthread.php?97781-quot-Herbie-quot-drains-WOW

 

[DaveB]

I don't care. I own a room full of canisters and there are holes in the bottom of the tank in odd places. I'm just going to hook the canisters to them.

Anyway, right now I'm worrying about running PEX and where to split things, not filtration.

 

[DaveB]

I'm currently leaning towards not using the RO unit at all and just doing a regular drip. Or at least not using the RO downstairs. Maybe I still will upstairs. We'll see. If I don't do that, I can just run the drip right into this tank and a drain line out and it'll be nice and easy.

I want to set up this Eheim and get some media seeded (though I need a ton more scrubbies, as it turns out) but I'm totally confused by the tubing on it. There's a giant 1" ID intake tub, but the tube coming out of the pump up top is tiny. I guess it's 1/2" but it seems way way smaller than the intake. That doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. Why is it so much different?

I guess the 2217 was like that too, now that I think of it... not quite as severe a difference though. I just wonder whether that little output is adequate for this application, since I was thinking that'd be the filter that uses the holes on the bottom. I'll have to adapt the thin tube to a pretty wide one at the bulkhead. And I worry that that'd put quite a bit of pressure on the pump. I guess it worked in this application (pic below... they used the same filter)...

I think my only dumb plumbing question that remains (for now, anyway) is whether I can T both FX5 returns into the same pipe for emergency draining. Actually, I'm sure I can, but I wonder what the diameter of that should be since it could theoretically be taking two full blast FX5s worth of water through it.

 

[DaveB]

It's kind of pointless for me to keep two threads going, especially since lately I've been swapping fish back and forth so often that it might as well all be the same tank anyway.

Original 120 Discus setup content, some photos, some sump/plumbing/RO/water chemistry discussion

OK, anyway, today I got bored so I decided it'd be fun to strip the 120 down to just a smaller colony of orangeheads and the one discus. I wanted to test the theory that they'd color up much more when they ran the tank... Japes mentioned this to me while I was pondering lighting choices and it bothered me that it never once occurred to me that their color dulling coincided directly with me getting the big Uaru and arowana.

(I did surely need new bulbs though. I ordered a bunch. It had been, no joke, over three years since I purchased a bulb... though I did have some that were less used that I rotated in a few times so it's not THAT lazy of me... OK, yeah it is.)

To accomplish this I had to drag my 135 - full of fish, mind you - out of the hall (the Uaru hate it there and crash into things whenever anyone walks by) to it's new temporary home, the bedroom. The wife is sure to love that. (Actually in the old house that's where we kept it... but in a much more attractive setup.) Moving giant tanks alone is always fun. In case you're wondering, the trick is bath mats, cardboard, and being strong like bull.

Anyway, 3 hours later, tank is moved, fish are traded, [some] algae is cleaned off some old fake plants, and two tanks are rescaped.

The plants could be distributed better, and my crappy camera won't let me capture the niceness of it with or without a flash... but this has some potential.

And if I don't have eggs within 3-4 days I'll be very surprised.

 

[DaveB]

OK, the discus hasn't colored all the way back up yet but I can already tell that this tank is going to look awesome with a bunch of them in here. I just love the way he's gliding peacefully around.

He seems to scare the dominant male orangehead though... so maybe the whole idea of them feeling like it's their tank is out the window...

It's amazing to me that 80w of T8 fluorescent (new) bulbs are substantially brighter than 130w of Compact Fluorescent. Part of it might be that they're elevated a bit more, so there aren't the same shadows on the back of the tank. I kind of liked how that was... the upper back was much darker and the stupid T return locline wasn't visible... I'm going to have to figure out a way to seal/hide that hole and have more normal side returns.

Another somewhat less crappy photo. Oh, and hey, I have an HD camera, I can use that, even though it also sucks (for different reasons). And yes, that's the Gypsy Kings in the background.

Video

 

[Pharaoh]

I'm currently leaning towards not using the RO unit at all and just doing a regular drip. Or at least not using the RO downstairs. Maybe I still will upstairs. We'll see. If I don't do that, I can just run the drip right into this tank and a drain line out and it'll be nice and easy.

I want to set up this Eheim and get some media seeded (though I need a ton more scrubbies, as it turns out) but I'm totally confused by the tubing on it. There's a giant 1" ID intake tub, but the tube coming out of the pump up top is tiny. I guess it's 1/2" but it seems way way smaller than the intake. That doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. Why is it so much different?

I guess the 2217 was like that too, now that I think of it... not quite as severe a difference though. I just wonder whether that little output is adequate for this application, since I was thinking that'd be the filter that uses the holes on the bottom. I'll have to adapt the thin tube to a pretty wide one at the bulkhead. And I worry that that'd put quite a bit of pressure on the pump. I guess it worked in this application (pic below... they used the same filter)...

I think my only dumb plumbing question that remains (for now, anyway) is whether I can T both FX5 returns into the same pipe for emergency draining. Actually, I'm sure I can, but I wonder what the diameter of that should be since it could theoretically be taking two full blast FX5s worth of water through it.

You should be fine with the filter tube coming from the bottom. I think you'll be OK.

You can T both returns, but you will nee to have tubing that is larger than 2x the diameter of the hose. FX5s have 1" tubing, so you will need at last 2.25-2.50" tubing to T them correctly. The cross sectional area of 2" PVC is not as high as 2-1" pieces of PVC.

 

[DaveB]

You should be fine with the filter tube coming from the bottom. I think you'll be OK.

You can T both returns, but you will nee to have tubing that is larger than 2x the diameter of the hose. FX5s have 1" tubing, so you will need at last 2.25-2.50" tubing to T them correctly. The cross sectional area of 2" PVC is not as high as 2-1" pieces of PVC.

See, I never would've thought of that. It'd be open on the other end, of course, but I suppose that'd just end up creating a geyser effect if I didn't have any extra space.

Maybe I'll just have one. 2.5" tubing probably won't fit in the wall...