Official Off Topic Discussion Thread #1

[imabot]

The irony of course is that:

https://www.sea.edu/plastics/frequently_asked_questions

3) That no one can actually demonstrate how this will ecologically affect the oceans or it's biological processes. Yes, it will be there a long time, but it's speculative if that will actually harm the ocean.

I wasn't limiting my scope. I'm not claiming that some animals out of the hundreds of thousands, or millions or tens of millions of any particular species hasn't been harmed. I'm suggesting that there is no evidence that the ocean ecosystem has been harmed.

Plastics are present in every major ocean basin, concentrated in regions that should be pristine environments far from sources of pollution on land. Plastic debris can threaten marine organisms through entanglement, especially by large debris such as derelict fishing gear, and by ingestion in organisms ranging in size from zooplankton to fish and larger animals such as sea turtles and seabirds. Additionally, plastics create a habitat for microorganisms and other species and can transport potentially invasive species to new regions of the ocean. Plastics are known to carry organic toxins such as PCBs, PBDEs, and PAHs, and may be responsible for the transfer these and other chemicals to marine organisms.

Couldn't plastic waste be ingested by a animal/organism and in turn the animal/organism be ingested along with the ingested plastic and so on?

 

[Drstrangelove]

Couldn't plastic waste be ingested by a animal/organism and in turn the animal/organism be ingested along with the ingested plastic and so on?

Sure. That's actually a reason we control things like mercury since it's accumulated in fish and shellfish and then somewhere down the line, eaten by people.

 

[J. H.]

Let's hope they don't pass laws banning lungs because they produce carbon dioxide

What did you think was the purpose of meditation?

Those bags are wasteful, as most people just throw them out. They serve no purpose other then to swell our garbage dumps.

I personally am annoyed because I use these bags to carry things, as garbage bags, and have just learned that you can weld them together with a clothes iron to make strong, flexible waterproof sheeting that can be used for watertight shed roofs, boat hulls, raincoats, etc., or weld them to broken HDPE/LDPE things to fix them.

 

[Deadliestviper7]

Don't know how much you've traveled or where you live but NY is no different than any large city. Philly, San Fran, Miami, Atlanta, and all of the other large cities I've been to equally suck. I'll tell you one thing I doubt many cities would have pulled through a 9/11 event like NYC did.

All the big cities are hell, I've been to to many

 

[Deadliestviper7]

Don't know how much you've traveled or where you live but NY is no different than any large city. Philly, San Fran, Miami, Atlanta, and all of the other large cities I've been to equally suck. I'll tell you one thing I doubt many cities would have pulled through a 9/11 event like NYC did.

All the big cities are hell, I've been to to many

 

[skjl47]

I wasn't limiting my scope

I'm suggesting that there is no evidence that the ocean ecosystem has been harmed

Isn't banning plastic bags in New Jersey (or California), at a time when the US produces 0.9% of all the plastic waste in the ocean, a bit extreme, and more like virtue signaling?

99.1% chance that everything in those animals didn't come from here.

Hello; Again an interesting view point. So allowing consideration of all possible plastic that makes it's way into the worlds oceans without any limiting of scope, you still suggest that no evidence exists of harm to the ocean ecosystem. I have seen film and photos of sea animals trapped in plastic such as sea turtles tangled with plastic. If we count fishing nets made of plastic we can add whales to the list.

Where the plastic comes from is good to know and the point that some of us are less guilty than others is also good to know. I do however like to keep my impact footprint small for the most part. Being able to point out a bigger polluter than myself is handy if all I want to do is have a somewhat less negative impact than the worst guy.

 

[Deadliestviper7]

The irony of course is that:

1) The top 5 countries that put the plastic in the oceans doesn't include, wait for it, the US. Sixty percent comes from east asia. Therefore, regardless of what we do, the issue isn't going away.

https://qz.com/595673/more-than-half-the-plastic-in-the-ocean-comes-from-these-five-countries/

2) Virtually all of the plastic has degraded to a size so small that it can't and shouldn't be physically removed. So those pictures of bags and bottles represents almost none of the actual plastic in the ocean. But it sells well to "greenies" to see a floating bottle or bag.

https://www.sea.edu/plastics/frequently_asked_questions

3) That no one can actually demonstrate how this will ecologically affect the oceans or it's biological processes. Yes, it will be there a long time, but it's speculative if that will actually harm the ocean.


But oh well. This is really what happens when people determined to save the environment descend to the least common denominator and ban, ban, ban. Let's hope they don't pass laws banning lungs because they produce carbon dioxide.

Actually we do know (to a degree) that this microplastic is harmful, it has been shown to kill fish, even cause sex changes in fish, even render them sterile, I can't imagine what it does to us when we eat them (although I think one study showed it may cause E.D)

 

[skjl47]

Hello; plastic is somewhat inert and non reactive so it is not going to be a toxin like mercury or lead. My take is the sheer volume is one factor. After all it is trash.

Another factor on initial consideration is if the gut of an animal is loaded with a volume of even inert stuff, then that bulk should interfere with the normal processing of food.

I do not have knowledge as to why a tax was placed on plastic bags. May be only another version of a "sin tax" with little or no thought of the environment. I generally do not like sin taxes on things such as tobacco, alcohol or sugary drinks.

 

[Deadliestviper7]

Hello; plastic is somewhat inert and non reactive so it is not going to be a toxin like mercury or lead. My take is the sheer volume is one factor. After all it is trash.

Another factor on initial consideration is if the gut of an animal is loaded with a volume of even inert stuff, then that bulk should interfere with the normal processing of food.

I do not have knowledge as to why a tax was placed on plastic bags. May be only another version of a "sin tax" with little or no thought of the environment. I generally do not like sin taxes on things such as tobacco, alcohol or sugary drinks.

Actually over time plastics tend to leach toxins into the enviorment.

I think a sin tax is not ok for things that generally only harm oneself, but I support a sin tax on cigarettes because that is proven to be deadly to others and to the general enviorment, this tax should go towards treating respiratory and cancer problems, and to cleaning up smog

 

[krichardson]

The biting flies are horrible this year.I cant even sit out on my porch and enjoy the breeze without them attacking me.