United States Invasive/Alien Species

[Rockbass6]

Because (assuming that's true - which I don't know anything about) we all know that bigger game fish are the main indicator of a healthy ecosystem.

Nice going there RockBass. You succeed in missing the total point.

The last time I went to Lake Michigan (8 yrs ago or so probably) I was so disappointed, having not been to any of the great lakes in several years, all I caught was round gobies. One after the other, NOTHING but round gobies, about 100 fish. Unfortunately at the time me and my dad had no idea what they were and kept throwing them back at first(for all we knew, they were native and there was just a large amount of them in that spot).
Finally someone else came along, we asked what they were and they explained.Me and my dad were so sickened that I'd just put all these nasty invasive pests back into the water. The ONLY people I saw take any instead of just putting them back was a group of chinese people collecting baskets full of them to eat. We ended up giving any subsequent catches to them.

So think whatever you want. Good for game fish and not destructive? Ok. I used to actually catch a pretty good variety of fish up there. Now there's so many round gobies it's not even funny. Where were the small bass and stuff I used to catch while fishing on shore or on the docks? And even then there was still a problem with other invasive fish, but I don't remember ever catching NOTHING but invasive fish, and the same species repeatedly for that matter.
SO WHAT if there might be ONE good thing they do. several invasive species are of benefit in some ways while being extremely destructive in others, it does NOT mean attempts shouldn't be made to limit their destruction and eliminate them from our native waterways.

Maybe you should try fishing off of the bottom. Gobys are only on the bottom and are NEVER anywhere else in the water column. Gobys don't bother me they actually attract perch to my boat. I go out anchor my boat, catch a few goby and kill them, let them sink to the bottom and the perch come over and eat them up and then see my minnow as a free meal. All I was trying to point out was that the gobys are here to stay and there is nothing we can do about it. I have actually been catching more fish since they have been in the lake. Most of the decline of both the walleye and the smallmouth bass in the lake erie was due to 2 repeated bad spawns in 1998-1999 and that was because of a strong east wind both times that made the water to cold for the fry to survive. (completely natural)If you want to talk about invasive species talk about steelhead trout. I feel they are overwelming the problem in the Great Lakes. The fish commission stalks millions of steelhead smolts every spring into the tribs of lake erie at 3-4 inches and they go out into lake erie and in one summer they come back as 17 inchers. They are eating everything in site! Most of their feed being smelt and smelt numbers have recently plummeted! There is nothing you or I can do about the round goby so you may as well accept that they are here to stay. Everyone is intitled to their opinon and I know first hand that the nothing can be done to stop the goby in the great lakes. Steelhead on the other hand can be stopped for the most part they have trouble naturally reproducing because of the slate bottoms in our tributaries. Maybe you should try fishing around here gobys are having little effects, maybe ten years from now when fish are bigger than ever and still extremely abundant just as they are now you will realize gobys arn't making as big of an impact as people first thought. As for the MIGHT you pointed out.. It is a good thing they do, everything eats them. Sheepshead, perch, walleye, lake trout, all types of bass..ect. Live with it and stop complaining look at the bright sides on this issue.

 

[rjmtx]

All I was trying to point out was that the gobys are here to stay and there is nothing we can do about it... Maybe you should try fishing around here gobys are having little effects, maybe ten years from now when fish are bigger than ever and still extremely abundant just as they are now you will realize gobys arn't making as big of an impact as people first thought. As for the MIGHT you pointed out.. It is a good thing they do, everything eats them. Sheepshead, perch, walleye, lake trout, all types of bass..ect. Live with it and stop complaining look at the bright sides on this issue.

This is the kind of defeatism that is rampant in some places where fisheries restoration is only an abstract idea. Who says we can't do anything about them? A few fish stockers working for the state? Has anyone really tried to find solutions to at least keep numbers down? There's a trap design out there, I'm sure. Right now permanent solutions are way off, but you've gotta start somewhere. Go to the U. of Michigan and tell them there's no solution, and see what they have to say about it.

Also, do you understand how contaminants will get passed on to the fish you're eating? I touched on it in my earlier post. Having a lake full of huge unreproductive inedible fish is a bleak future because there's still one step left after that.

If "live with it and stop complaining" were the norm in environmental crises (which this is), you wouldn't be going around spewing that garbage. I'm not being an idealist saying there is a solution. I think it's a very realist point of view. Get some minds together, and start workin it out. Maybe there is no solution, but how do we know?

 

[Rockbass6]

This is the kind of defeatism that is rampant in some places where fisheries restoration is only an abstract idea. Who says we can't do anything about them? A few fish stockers working for the state? Has anyone really tried to find solutions to at least keep numbers down? There's a trap design out there, I'm sure. Right now permanent solutions are way off, but you've gotta start somewhere. Go to the U. of Michigan and tell them there's no solution, and see what they have to say about it.

Also, do you understand how contaminants will get passed on to the fish you're eating? I touched on it in my earlier post. Having a lake full of huge unreproductive inedible fish is a bleak future because there's still one step left after that.

If "live with it and stop complaining" were the norm in environmental crises (which this is), you wouldn't be going around spewing that garbage. I'm not being an idealist saying there is a solution. I think it's a very realist point of view. Get some minds together, and start workin it out. Maybe there is no solution, but how do we know?

I recieved all my information from either Penn State University Professor Carrick or The Sons of lake erie research team. They have accepted that they goby are present in lake erie and are studying ways they can get out and cause harm to neighboring watersheds. Here is a link to the results of one of their tributary research results. Gobys are not makin it far up the streams.http://www.erie.psu.edu/seagrant/publications/newsletters/2002winter.pdf
I am not getting my information from what your calling "fish stockers" The sons of lake erie are the ones who did a study on the smallmouth and how in the same amount of time it used to take them to get 12inches they are now 14-15inches in the same amount of time. This is why they feel the state records will fall.
Also, if you catch a fish from goby in a infested watershed check the stomach when you clean them and see whats in it. Most of the time there will be 4 or 5 gobys inside if not more. Fish love eating them, at first they though they didn't because of their large head, but no they know they do. Why do you guys insist that the goby are going to kill all of the natural reproduction? If this were the case I think it would have already happened. Just my opinion on that one... Here is another article on the study of dead zones in lake erie and how they are trying to figure out how its happening. http://aginfo.psu.edu/News/november02/erie.html Give him a call if you want and see what he says about their being a solution for where gobys are already present. His number is at the end of the article.
I don't no what michgan is studying you can fill me in on what they have learned. I would be interested. I was just sharing some information I have learned from my local research team. Fish are getting bigger than ever and the goby isn't having as much effect on the reproduction as they thought. Smallmouth are the fish the biologists are mainly concerned about currently because they spawn so late sometimes running into late june. Most of the other natives are spawning early in the spring when the water is still colder and the goby is less active.

 

[Sasquatch Smash]

Also, if you catch a fish from goby in a infested watershed check the stomach when you clean them and see whats in it. Most of the time there will be 4 or 5 gobys inside if not more. Fish love eating them, at first they though they didn't because of their large head, but no they know they do.

Just because their stomachs are full of them doesn't mean they love eating them. It could be because, as you said the waters are infested, there are no other food items available. Which could be caused by the round goby's predation on smaller native fish and fish fry in general. When there is a choice do the predators prefer the goby to native food sources?

 

[Rockbass6]

Just because their stomachs are full of them doesn't mean they love eating them. It could be because, as you said the waters are infested, there are no other food items available. Which could be caused by the round goby's predation on smaller native fish and fish fry in general. When there is a choice do the predators prefer the goby to native food sources?

No native food items are available? Are you kidding me? Its simple gobys are easy to catch. I could go snorkling and catch them with one of my 12 inch nets from one of my fish tanks. Emeralds on the other hand good luck they are extremely fast swimmers you need a bigger net and have a whole school to catch them. Most fish are opportunists and the slow fish get eatin. Its survival of the fittest and the fastest have a better chance of surviving. There are plenty of native fish here. Gobys are just slower and are an easy meal. Are you even from an area that has been effected by gobys? Louisiana? hmm.. Why do you think fishing lure companies try and sell lures that look like wounded fish? and ever since the beginning of time they have taught fisherman to drop back right after a big fish smacks their bait? Its the same consept most fish are opportunistic.

 

[mjschultz]

Actually, goby's are easy to catch for the simple reason that they are out competing a lot of other native species. They are highly territorial and very aggressive. No invasive species is good for an ecosystem and goby's are no exception. While many people have given up hope on finding solutions, there is still much we need to learn about goby's before we can take proper action.

Carp are another group of fish that can cause serious damage to an ecosystem and also push out other species.

 

[Louie]

Well personaly im glad Carp took over Canadian waterways..
There a fun fish to catch put up alot of fight, get HUGE..
and noone eats the suckers like bass...

Nothing is better then catching 40 pound 3+ Foot carp!

I like non natives also. Around here they are the only fish in the canals . If it wasnt for them the canals would be barren mosquito breeding paradise.
non natives that displace natives I dont like but many non natives simply are able to survive where natives were "pushed out" due to pollution and other man created problems thus I prefer non natives over nothing.

 

[Louie]

Actually, goby's are easy to catch for the simple reason that they are out competing a lot of other native species. They are highly territorial and very aggressive. No invasive species is good for an ecosystem and goby's are no exception. While many people have given up hope on finding solutions, there is still much we need to learn about goby's before we can take proper action.

Carp are another group of fish that can cause serious damage to an ecosystem and also push out other species.

In this case I agree esp since from what I read gobies eat native darters and the gobies didnt fill a niche created by natives being killed by pollution.etc.
In Florida non native brown anoles are taking over. The gvmt likes to say they out compete the native green anoles as thats easy to say but in truth the green anoles have been displaced by same gvmt selling wild land and allowing a sea of golf courses to be built where there was once trees,shrubery.
the green anoles which are much more arboreal than non native brown anoles die out . The lack of land they need kills them . Thus its either brown anoles or no life at all.
I think many times the non natives fill an empty niche CREATED by humans and ofcourse its easier to blame them than the lack of wild land or pollution.
In the gobies case its not that but many times it is.

 

[soggysandwich]

I HATE CARP. there are like zero bass in my neighbor hood pond because of them.

 

[meepster]

I HATE CARP. there are like zero bass in my neighbor hood pond because of them.

umm Carp don't eat bass or occupy the same niche as them. Bass eat other fish, Carp are scavengers.