Mega Powerful Nitrate and Phosphate Remover - DIY!
- Thread starter SantaMonica
- Start date
Neither of those reasons make it more efficient. The roots staying alive longer just extends the amount of time between cleanings. And twice as much light means just that, your using twice the wattage. You would need to more than double the algae growth to make it more efficient. It would make for a good experiment to find out what the harvest weights/Kilowatt hour are on various types of scrubber designs.Keeps the roots alive longer. Light from both sides is twice as much light.
After going through more of this thread I found some other statements that I find interesting. They may be true, I'm just curious as to why they're true.
---It won't work if you keep your lights on 24hrs a day. What happens if you do?
---The hair algae is the best algae for a scrubber. Does it make best use of the light in terms of growth? Is simply the easiest to harvest?
I just found this thread today, and find it really interesting. I don't want to come of as if I know more about this stuff than those of you who have already operated these scrubbers for a while. I don't even have an aquarium at the time. But I do have a pretty firm grasp of the concepts at work here. So I'm hoping I don't get on your nerves by questioning some of your statements. I figure it's the best way to figure out the best way to do this.
I still think a tube with one of the long style compact florescent bulbs hanging in the middle of a tube of algae covered fabric/mesh would be more energy efficient than these other designs. And also, if the light intensity drops off too low after 3 months, my guess is that the wattage was picked too low to begin with. Planted aquariums and reef aquariums have much longer replacement cycles and they are arguably much more sensitive to a decrease in light intensity than someone simply trying to grow algae.
No, the roots staying alive keeps the algae attached which lets it filter. When they detach it stops filtering.The roots staying alive longer just extends the amount of time between cleanings.
So your saying that the "roots" staying alive longer keeps the algae attached to the substrate longer allowing them to keep absorbing nutrients for harvest?No, the roots staying alive keeps the algae attached which lets it filter. When they detach it stops filtering.
Following that train of thought, if algae illuminated from one side only reaches the point where the algae breaks free sooner you would have to harvest it before that happens.
Kinda sounds like what I wrote.
That's a good point which I hadn't thought of. Do you think the cleanings slow the growth down significantly? How long does it take till it's back at full growth potential?
It's a tradeoff. More small cleaning keep the algae at a good length but require more work. Fewer big cleaning are easy but stop filtering for a while.
Phosphate flow out of rocks
Many people, when they get their scrubber running for the first time, get worried when more (not less) algae starts to grow on their rocks. It seems really strange, especially when nitrate and phosphate have gone lower than before. What is happening is that phosphate is coming out of the rocks. Remember, phosphate is invisible, so you can only see the effects of it, and it always "flows" from higher concentrations to lower concentrations (just like heat does).
Example: If your room is warm, and you put a cold object on the floor, heat from the air in the room will "flow" into the object until the object and the air are the same temperature. Example 2: If you put a hot object on the floor, heat will "flow" out of the object and go into the air in the room, again, until the air and the object are the same temperature. Now suppose you open your windows (in the winter). The warm air in your room will go out the windows, and it will get colder in the room. The object on the floor is now warmer than the air, so heat will flow out of the object and into the air, and then out the window.
Think of phosphate as the heat, and your rocks as the object, and your windows as the scrubber. As the scrubber pulls phosphate out of the water, the phosphate level in the water drops. Now, since the phosphate level in the water is lower than the phosphate level in the rocks, phosphate flows from the rocks into the water, and then from the water into the scrubber. This continues until the phosphate levels in the rocks and water are level again. And remember, you can't see this invisible flow.
This flow causes an interesting thing happens. As the phosphate comes out of the rocks, it then becomes available to feed algae as soon as the phosphate reaches the surface of the rocks where there is light. So, since the surface of the rocks is rough and has light, it starts growing MORE algae there (not less) as the phosphate comes out of the rocks. This is a pretty amazing thing to see for the first time, because if you did not know what was happening you would probably think that the algae in the scrubber was leaking out and attaching to your rocks. Here are the signs of phosphate coming out of the rocks:
1. The rocks are older, and have slowly developed algae problems in the past year.
2. The scrubber is new, maybe only a few months old, and has recently started to grow well.
3. Nitrate and phosphate measurements in the water are low, usually the lowest they have been in a long time.
4. Green hair algae (not brown) on the rocks has increased in certain spots, usually on corners and protrusions at the top.
5. The glass has not needed cleaning as much.
Since skimmers, filter socks, etc don't remove any nitrate and phosphate, and waterchanges and macro's in a fuge don't remove much, most people have never seen the effects of large amounts of phosphate coming out of the rocks quickly. But sure enough, it does. How long does it continue? For 2 months to a year, depending on how much phosphate is in the rocks, how strong your scrubber is, and how many other phosphate-removing filters you have (GFO, carbon dosing, etc). But one day you will see patches of white rock that were covered in green hair the day before; this is a sure sign that the algae are losing their phosphate supply from the rocks and can no longer hold on. Now it's just a matter of days before the rocks are clear.
Many people, when they get their scrubber running for the first time, get worried when more (not less) algae starts to grow on their rocks. It seems really strange, especially when nitrate and phosphate have gone lower than before. What is happening is that phosphate is coming out of the rocks. Remember, phosphate is invisible, so you can only see the effects of it, and it always "flows" from higher concentrations to lower concentrations (just like heat does).
Example: If your room is warm, and you put a cold object on the floor, heat from the air in the room will "flow" into the object until the object and the air are the same temperature. Example 2: If you put a hot object on the floor, heat will "flow" out of the object and go into the air in the room, again, until the air and the object are the same temperature. Now suppose you open your windows (in the winter). The warm air in your room will go out the windows, and it will get colder in the room. The object on the floor is now warmer than the air, so heat will flow out of the object and into the air, and then out the window.
Think of phosphate as the heat, and your rocks as the object, and your windows as the scrubber. As the scrubber pulls phosphate out of the water, the phosphate level in the water drops. Now, since the phosphate level in the water is lower than the phosphate level in the rocks, phosphate flows from the rocks into the water, and then from the water into the scrubber. This continues until the phosphate levels in the rocks and water are level again. And remember, you can't see this invisible flow.
This flow causes an interesting thing happens. As the phosphate comes out of the rocks, it then becomes available to feed algae as soon as the phosphate reaches the surface of the rocks where there is light. So, since the surface of the rocks is rough and has light, it starts growing MORE algae there (not less) as the phosphate comes out of the rocks. This is a pretty amazing thing to see for the first time, because if you did not know what was happening you would probably think that the algae in the scrubber was leaking out and attaching to your rocks. Here are the signs of phosphate coming out of the rocks:
1. The rocks are older, and have slowly developed algae problems in the past year.
2. The scrubber is new, maybe only a few months old, and has recently started to grow well.
3. Nitrate and phosphate measurements in the water are low, usually the lowest they have been in a long time.
4. Green hair algae (not brown) on the rocks has increased in certain spots, usually on corners and protrusions at the top.
5. The glass has not needed cleaning as much.
Since skimmers, filter socks, etc don't remove any nitrate and phosphate, and waterchanges and macro's in a fuge don't remove much, most people have never seen the effects of large amounts of phosphate coming out of the rocks quickly. But sure enough, it does. How long does it continue? For 2 months to a year, depending on how much phosphate is in the rocks, how strong your scrubber is, and how many other phosphate-removing filters you have (GFO, carbon dosing, etc). But one day you will see patches of white rock that were covered in green hair the day before; this is a sure sign that the algae are losing their phosphate supply from the rocks and can no longer hold on. Now it's just a matter of days before the rocks are clear.
Great ideas for algae scrubbers. I'm in the process of designing a 2-piece cylindrical version with a conical interior shape for maximum surface area.
