Flowerhorns and vegetables

Ruturaj

Goliath Tigerfish
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JSpilo JSpilo I am not sure if you are angry towards me because I suggested NLS float. It's still a good food and if your fish is being finicky, trying to starve it is not a bad idea. If you want stick with northfin, it's a good brand too. Fish eating or not eating a pellet is not a good way of determining pellet quality.
 
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RD.

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She's 4" eats 3-4mm pellets.

I feed 3-4mm pellets to Large Fish. In fact, NLS 3mm Float formula is called Float Large Fish.

I feed 8"+ - 13"+ cichlids in my tanks 3-4 mm pellets, including all of the brands mentioned here. In commercial aquaculture no one in their right mind would feed a 4" fish, 3-4mm pellets. Classic case of operator error, and once again the food gets blamed. lol
 

JSpilo

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I'm not angry towards you Ruturaj Ruturaj . Not at all.
I'm upset with NLS for making crappy fish food.

RD. RD. My girl eats 3mm with no mess. Only with NLS. And yes I'm blaming NLS for making crap. There's no "classic operator error" here. Don't play me as a moron. Now THIS pisses me off.
 

RD.

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I didn't say that you were a moron, but your actions regarding this subject are certainly quite juvenile. This discussion wasn't about you, your fish, or any particular brand of fish food - yet you somehow felt the need to come in here and stomp your feet about your recent experience with pellets that certainly sound too large for your fish? Okay! lol

This hobby is a never ending learning curve, so you either learn from your experiences, and those of others, or you don't. The fact that "some" pellets are more dense, or harder, or whatever, can influence the size required for the individual fish. See second quote below. You made an assumption based on other foods that you have fed, and it didn't play out. That somehow makes the food crappy? Grow up. I have raised several FH over the years, they ate NLS exclusively, and I never had any feed issues. Gee, I wonder how that happened? As I previously stated, 3-4mm is a bit of a stretch for a 4" FH. You can argue that point all you want, many years of feeding fish, including several flowerhorns tells me otherwise. Obviously with this particular brand, it didn't work out so well. Not too sure how that qualifies the food itself as being crappy? Having approx. 20 years of experience with this brand I wouldn't have recommended a 3-4mm pellet for a 4" flowerhorn.



https://www.aquaafrica.co.za/blog-articles/leslie-ter-morshuizen/1/correct-feed-particle-size/18



Correct Feed Particle Size​

March 27, 2015 | BY Leslie Ter Morshuizen



Commercial fish farming depends on providing the fish with sufficient feed of the correctly nutritional quality to promote maximum, healthy growth. Although live feeds are important and serve numerous specific needs, it is seldom workable to feed fish exclusively on live feeds. We therefore generally rely on artificial feeds for the feeding of our fish to enjoy the benefits of bulk availability, storage and operational simplicity offered by this option. As artificial feeds are supplied in different pellet sizes, starting from a powder via crumble to a large pellet, we naturally need to know how to select the feed size that is best suited the cohort of fish being fed.



Obviously the gape of the fish’s mouth is the first factor to consider; if the pellet cannot fit into the mouth it will not be ingested immediately. As the pellet soaks water and softens, the fish will nibble at it, causing the pellet to fall apart and enabling the fish to eat pieces of the pellet. This causes large amounts of feed to be wasted as bits fall to the tank floor and certain elements dissolve into the water. However, it is equally important that the pellet should not be too small as the fish will usually not feed to satiation on pellets that are too small, especially in predatory fish where the size of the pellet is important to elicit an attack response.



If the pellet can fit into the gape of the fish, but only just, the fish tend not to digest the feed completely. This is evidenced by undigested pellets seen whilst inspecting the faeces. If the feed is not being digested it is clearly not contributing to growth!



Small fish require more protein in their diet than do larger fish of the same species, so the feed manufacturers include more protein in the diet of the smaller fish, thus in the smaller feed particle sizes. Feeding large fish on small pellets will therefore also result in unnecessary protein in the diet, which translates directly to financial waste as protein is expensive.



All this imprecision begs the question: `how do you know what the correct pellet size is for a group of fish?’



I do not believe that there is a simple one-size-fits-all type of solution due to the divergent dietary strategies employed by different species of fish. Predators tend to subdue and swallow large, infrequent meals whereas detritivores and herbivores are more inclined to nibble continuously. It is therefore necessary to consider the behaviour of the species you are farming in determining the most appropriate pellet size. However, the principle is that the feed particle must comfortably fit into the mouth of the fish. Practically, the pellet should be between ¼ to ½ of the area of the gape, with predators tending to receive larger pellets than other species. Ensure that the fish can comfortably eat the feed being fed, but err on the side of larger pellets rather than smaller pellets as this shortens feeding time and the fish tend to reach satiation more easily."






https://www.researchgate.net/public...ile_Nile_tilapia_Oreochromis_niloticus_L_1758

"The preferred or optimum food particle size can be dependent on
the hardness of the food (e.g. sizes of 40–60% MW for hard pellets
versus up to 100% for soft paste balls in A. anguilla,Knights, 1983)."



https://thefishsite.com/articles/how-big-are-your-fish-pellets

"As a general rule of thumb, pellet are generally considered optimal at sizes 25% – 50% of the fish’s mouth width. However, as with anything, the relationship between pellet size and growth rate is not entirely straight forward.

Pellet size is clearly important from one key physiological perspective – the individual’s mouth. Give a fish a pellet larger than its gape, and not only may it have trouble eating that pellet, but it could even choke. The way a fish eats is also an important factor in considering what size pellet to offer. Gilthead sea bream (Sparus aurata), for example, essentially “chew” large pellets before swallowing them. During chewing, some feed is lost into the water, and with it precious nutrients that could otherwise be used for growth. Recent work from scientist Mateo Ballester Moltó (Instituto Murciano de Investigación y Desarrollo Agrario y Alimentario, Spain) demonstrated that feeding pellets smaller in size than manufacturer recommendations to gilthead sea bream reduced the need for chewing, reducing the loss of up to 42 grams of feed per kilogram of fish."




Good luck
 

JSpilo

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”Quite juvenile"? Did I hurt your feelings, Mr. NLS Fanboy? Let me tell you something, my stomping my feet was a vent. You attacked me by calling me a moron and juvenile. You don't like what I have to say, STFU and move on. Just say NEXT! and ignore the comments. But I made the NLS Fanboy butthurt. I didn't mean to upset you. I'm sorry.
 
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RD.

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LOL, I didn't call you a moron - but you are certainly acting very juvenile.

I also posted:
I feed 8"+ - 13"+ cichlids in my tanks 3-4 mm pellets, including all of the brands mentioned here.
Among other things, my 8 yr old 13-14" male citrinellus eats Hikari, 3.5-4mm floating Blood Red Parrot + pellets.

Don't act like you know me, son, you don't know anything about me. But if you were smart, you'd pay attention and learn a thing or two. Either way, your behaviour and how you progress, or don't, in this hobby will have zero effect on me. Good luck.

One of my cichlids, that consumes 3-4mm floating AND sinking pellets.

1586567240808.png
 
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JSpilo

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LOL, I didn't call you a moron - but you are certainly acting very juvenile.

I also posted:


Among other things, my 8 yr old 13-14" male citrinellus eats Hikari, 3.5-4mm floating Blood Red Parrot + pellets.

Don't act like you know me, son, you don't know anything about me. But if you were smart, you'd pay attention and learn a thing or two. Either way, your behaviour and how you progress, or don't, in this hobby will have zero effect on me. Good luck.

One of my cichlids, that consumes 3-4mm floating AND sinking pellets.

View attachment 1412707
They way you just responded by saying "if you're smart", is calling me a moron. You seem to enjoy belittling others, don't you? Are you autistic? If so, I completely understand and I apologise. If not, you're a bully that acts like they're high and mighty on a forum. You need to learn how to properly communicate, without subtly putting people down. It's that grandiose and pompous attitude that you have. Do you really think you're that awesome? Because you worked as a fish food distributor? Your opinions are just that, opinions. BUT congrats on your fish and your feeding habits.
 

Cichlids keeper

Candiru
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Yeah it's my fault for venting in the first place. Sorry again. Didn't mean to upset the NLS fanboy.
I'll do my best not to hijack any more threads in the future, I promise.
It's not that you hijacked it, I don't really care about that. It's that you both went way too far. I would suggest trying to actually solve a disagreement peacefully without insulting each other.
 
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