ID assistance please

[danotaylor]

G’day folks. I drove to Chicago from Cincy on Sunday and picked up a trio of rays for my 10’x3’x2.5’ 500gal acrylic tank.
Pic 1 a 12” male black diamond hybrid
Pic 2&3 is a 15” female black diamond hybrid
Pic 4&5 is a 16” female super hybrid.

The seller did not know the genetic mix of these rays.

Its not super important, but I am interested in opinions as to the crosses used to produce these hybrids.

Please take a sqiz at the pics and lemme know what you think.

Thanks











Here's a short video the morning after I intro'd them to my tank. Excuse the slightly cloudy water, as you can see they have mounded up the newly rinsed sand into the middle of the tank swimming back & forth along the front panel! Lol.

You can see some marks on the super hybrid female from recent breeding attempts by the BD hybrid male.

 

[danotaylor]

No-one??

 

[tlindsey]

No-one??

Welcome aboard
Tagging experienced freshwater stingray member.
spotfin

 

[danotaylor]

Welcome aboard
Tagging experienced freshwater stingray member.
spotfin

I appreciate your assistance, and thanks for the welcome!!

 

[wednesday13]

Hard to tell with mutts these days unless you know the breeder. Used to be a pretty close knit community of private breeders on this forum, but with the influx of cheaper hybrids imported from over seas we all pretty much stopped breeding. Cant compete with the prices. Last pic (brown ray) is def. heavy motoro. Looks like a mantilla which was always speculated to be a wild hybrid. 1st pic (male) most likely has some motoro blood in there also. The female seems to have the most “pure” blood in it. Probably bdxleo. The male will change the most as it grows. Could end up being more brown with age, could stay dark base. Only time will tell. When you make it to breeding with this trio the pups might all be more brown base.

 

[danotaylor]

Hard to tell with mutts these days unless you know the breeder. Used to be a pretty close knit community of private breeders on this forum, but with the influx of cheaper hybrids imported from over seas we all pretty much stopped breeding. Cant compete with the prices. Last pic (brown ray) is def. heavy motoro. Looks like a mantilla which was always speculated to be a wild hybrid. 1st pic (male) most likely has some motoro blood in there also. The female seems to have the most “pure” blood in it. Probably bdxleo. The male will change the most as it grows. Could end up being more brown with age, could stay dark base. Only time will tell. When you make it to breeding with this trio the pups might all be more brown base.

I really appreciate your response mate. Thank you!

IYO what size should I expect a hybrid w Motoro genetics to reach? I am hoping that the 2 BD hybrid rays produce dark based pups but I know nothing of the strength of different ray species genetics and which would be dominant when mixed.

There are 2 privately owned specialty aquarium stores here in Cinci that are interested in pups if I can produce them. I see predatory fins selling hybrid pups retail anywhere from 400-1000 ish depending on the color & pattern. Do you have any idea what pups from this trip could be worth privately? Or wholesale to a retail stores?

I appreciate any further info you can provide. For now I am enjoying my first ray experience in 40yrs in the hobby!

 

[wednesday13]

I really appreciate your response mate. Thank you!

IYO what size should I expect a hybrid w Motoro genetics to reach? I am hoping that the 2 BD hybrid rays produce dark based pups but I know nothing of the strength of different ray species genetics and which would be dominant when mixed.

There are 2 privately owned specialty aquarium stores here in Cinci that are interested in pups if I can produce them. I see predatory fins selling hybrid pups retail anywhere from 400-1000 ish depending on the color & pattern. Do you have any idea what pups from this trip could be worth privately? Or wholesale to a retail stores?

I appreciate any further info you can provide. For now I am enjoying my first ray experience in 40yrs in the hobby!

IME… female mantillas or brown rays with motoro blood have the potential to reach 28” wide and larger pretty easily. 36”+ long. Males are always smaller. Typically 18-20” average. I have seen male motoro 30” wide tho also. The blk female should hit 24-26” wide pretty easily and can hit 30” also. U have a ways to go yet before breeding. Males mature at 2-3 yrs… females 3-5 yrs. Usually around 16-18” wide for the females. Id guess yours are around 1-2 yrs old.
As for price on hybrid pups, thats always debatable. You can get albino pearls these days for 350-500 so any hybrids and or brown rays have dropped alot. $200-250 range. Predatory is high on most stuff. When i got out of breeding a few yrs ago my blacks all sold pretty easy. I ended up giving away 2 mature males for free with lack of interest. 1 mantilla and 1 mantillaxleo. They were worth $300-400 range easy and no1 cared lol…

Pure bloods are becoming hard to get so thats kinda where the money is at now. That or albino. Sure the market can always change but its kinda tough out there right now for the “home breeder”… if u can get rid of pups at a lfs thats prob ur best bet to recoop some funds for food or new acquisitions. Never know tho, rays could pick up again in the future. If you ship that helps alot also. Its time consuming doing air port runs and dealing with people tho also …

Just enjoy them… if u make it to breeding one day go from there

 

[danotaylor]

Really appreciate the input mate!
The male disc is 12-13” and the BDH female disc is pretty close to 16” and the SH female disc is almost 17”.
Ima just sit back, feed these 3 up and do water changes bi-weekly and see what happens. Hopefully we see some pups inside the year
Thank you for you response!!

 

[DIDYSIS]

pssh ya like you would know..........

Hard to tell with mutts these days unless you know the breeder. Used to be a pretty close knit community of private breeders on this forum, but with the influx of cheaper hybrids imported from over seas we all pretty much stopped breeding. Cant compete with the prices. Last pic (brown ray) is def. heavy motoro. Looks like a mantilla which was always speculated to be a wild hybrid. 1st pic (male) most likely has some motoro blood in there also. The female seems to have the most “pure” blood in it. Probably bdxleo. The male will change the most as it grows. Could end up being more brown with age, could stay dark base. Only time will tell. When you make it to breeding with this trio the pups might all be more brown base.

 

[wednesday13]

pssh ya like you would know..........

Comin outta the wood work lol… … miss the good ole days on here