Cleaning Arowana Tank - HELP!

[Dixon81]

Here are some pictures of my latest 180 build. The pictures are in no particular order. I used a 40 gallon breeder for my sump, bought a pre-made filter sock holder, 1/4" acrylic for the baffles, Jabeo DC 900 for the return pump. I drilled a hole in the pump chamber to act as my drain for my drip system. The first chamber is full of submerged bio media, the second chamber holds more bio media and my thermometers, the 3rd chamber has 25 micron filter pad and a drip plate. Under the drip plate are bio balls acting as emerged media, below the bio balls is submerged pond matrix. Ask as many questions as you would like.

I also have a silver aro, 2 rays, silver dollars, and a few geophagus

 

[Coryloach]

Sump may sound like a great idea, due to the volume of biomedia they can hold but theoretically and practically biofiltration is limited to the amount of oxygen available in the system, not the amount of media. Any filtration that has the capacity to be clogged with dirt for one or another reason, can significantly underperform when it comes to filtration. A sump is also too complicated and made of too many connections, glass tank, etc...that are prone to leak over time...

Any filter that also siphons the floating debris will not be very efficient as biofiltration due to the amount of dirt/debris it collects, promoting totally different conditions than those needed for nitrifying bacteria.

I'd stick with external filters for the time being if you already have them, and put large medium/coarse sponges as pre-filters to prevent the media inside from getting dirty easily. Increase surface agitation to the max, and siphon stuff that collects on the bottom during water changes, wash the prefilters then too. They may not look dirty on the outside but gather a ton of mini particles when the water gets pulled in.

I don't keep rays but I go for months without cleaning the external fitlers. Majority of debris falls at the bottom of the filter and does not gather on media. When using pre-filter sponges on the intakes you'd be surprised how clean the filters stay and how rarely you need to clean them. I also keep my intakes at a good distance from the bottom, almost halfway up to also prevent bottom debris being sucked up easily. And even if the filters leak, they can't drain the whole tank... I've had many fails over the years and I've figured the simpler, the better.

 

[GoldFinger]

Sump may sound like a great idea, due to the volume of biomedia they can hold but theoretically and practically biofiltration is limited to the amount of oxygen available in the system, not the amount of media. Any filtration that has the capacity to be clogged with dirt for one or another reason, can significantly underperform when it comes to filtration. A sump is also too complicated and made of too many connections, glass tank, etc...that are prone to leak over time...

Any filter that also siphons the floating debris will not be very efficient as biofiltration due to the amount of dirt/debris it collects, promoting totally different conditions than those needed for nitrifying bacteria.

I'd stick with external filters for the time being if you already have them, and put large medium/coarse sponges as pre-filters to prevent the media inside from getting dirty easily. Increase surface agitation to the max, and siphon stuff that collects on the bottom during water changes, wash the prefilters then too. They may not look dirty on the outside but gather a ton of mini particles when the water gets pulled in.

I don't keep rays but I go for months without cleaning the external fitlers. Majority of debris falls at the bottom of the filter and does not gather on media. When using pre-filter sponges on the intakes you'd be surprised how clean the filters stay and how rarely you need to clean them. I also keep my intakes at a good distance from the bottom, almost halfway up to also prevent bottom debris being sucked up easily. And even if the filters leak, they can't drain the whole tank... I've had many fails over the years and I've figured the simpler, the better.

I think I'm going to give the canisters a try and see how it goes. I may not even get a ray. Where do the sponges go on the intake? Do you just shove them in or? What do you use for surface agitation? Is a bubbler enough? I have a circ/wave pump but wanted to use it lower in the tank to help push up debris into the other intake lines in if the canisters. Thanks

 

[Bigfishnut]

Sump may sound like a great idea, due to the volume of biomedia they can hold but theoretically and practically biofiltration is limited to the amount of oxygen available in the system, not the amount of media. Any filtration that has the capacity to be clogged with dirt for one or another reason, can significantly underperform when it comes to filtration. A sump is also too complicated and made of too many connections, glass tank, etc...that are prone to leak over time...

Any filter that also siphons the floating debris will not be very efficient as biofiltration due to the amount of dirt/debris it collects, promoting totally different conditions than those needed for nitrifying bacteria.

I'd stick with external filters for the time being if you already have them, and put large medium/coarse sponges as pre-filters to prevent the media inside from getting dirty easily. Increase surface agitation to the max, and siphon stuff that collects on the bottom during water changes, wash the prefilters then too. They may not look dirty on the outside but gather a ton of mini particles when the water gets pulled in.

I don't keep rays but I go for months without cleaning the external fitlers. Majority of debris falls at the bottom of the filter and does not gather on media. When using pre-filter sponges on the intakes you'd be surprised how clean the filters stay and how rarely you need to clean them. I also keep my intakes at a good distance from the bottom, almost halfway up to also prevent bottom debris being sucked up easily. And even if the filters leak, they can't drain the whole tank... I've had many fails over the years and I've figured the simpler, the better.

WHAT?!!? Anyone on here keeping fish that cost $1000+ each is using sump filtration I promise you. A properly set up sump is far more efficient and dependable than any canister. Filter socks take care of anything getting to your bio media, and overflows will never allow your tank to drain any lower than the normal level. What is it with you guys and your canister filters? Those things are overpriced toys for rookie fish keepers in my opinion! Sump...fluidized media...filter socks...that is how it's done with large tanks, large expensive fish. Anything else and you are wasting your time and money.

 

[Bigfishnut]

Oh, nice set up DiXoN !! Nice hens too!!

 

[Dixon81]

Oh, nice set up DiXoN !! Nice hens too!!

I think you tagged the wrong Dixon but thanks for the compliment.

 

[Bigfishnut]

I think you tagged the wrong Dixon but thanks for the compliment.

Lol!! Oops!! I meant Dixon81

 

[Galantspeedz]

WHAT?!!? Anyone on here keeping fish that cost $1000+ each is using sump filtration I promise you. A properly set up sump is far more efficient and dependable than any canister. Filter socks take care of anything getting to your bio media, and overflows will never allow your tank to drain any lower than the normal level. What is it with you guys and your canister filters? Those things are overpriced toys for rookie fish keepers in my opinion! Sump...fluidized media...filter socks...that is how it's done with large tanks, large expensive fish. Anything else and you are wasting your time and money.

i am sure every type of filters have their pro and cons

and there are many reasons why different people use different filters so please stop generalising

 

[Fish Tank Travis]

Sump may sound like a great idea, due to the volume of biomedia they can hold but theoretically and practically biofiltration is limited to the amount of oxygen available in the system, not the amount of media. Any filtration that has the capacity to be clogged with dirt for one or another reason, can significantly underperform when it comes to filtration. A sump is also too complicated and made of too many connections, glass tank, etc...that are prone to leak over time...

Any filter that also siphons the floating debris will not be very efficient as biofiltration due to the amount of dirt/debris it collects, promoting totally different conditions than those needed for nitrifying bacteria.

I'd stick with external filters for the time being if you already have them, and put large medium/coarse sponges as pre-filters to prevent the media inside from getting dirty easily. Increase surface agitation to the max, and siphon stuff that collects on the bottom during water changes, wash the prefilters then too. They may not look dirty on the outside but gather a ton of mini particles when the water gets pulled in.

I don't keep rays but I go for months without cleaning the external fitlers. Majority of debris falls at the bottom of the filter and does not gather on media. When using pre-filter sponges on the intakes you'd be surprised how clean the filters stay and how rarely you need to clean them. I also keep my intakes at a good distance from the bottom, almost halfway up to also prevent bottom debris being sucked up easily. And even if the filters leak, they can't drain the whole tank... I've had many fails over the years and I've figured the simpler, the better.

I'm sorry but you are the first person I have ever heard say that a canister is better than a sump so...I'm going to go out on the limb and have to disagree with you. I've had canisters, HOB's and a sump. The sump is by far the easiest to maintain and is definitely the most effective. As I mentioned before, canisters have their place, but for big tanks with expensive fish, I don't think anything will perform better than a sump.

Also, as far as the reliability of a sump, if set up properly, they can be very reliable.

A sump is definitely harder to set up at first. However, it creates a much easier maintenance and a better system.

As far as oxygenation, sumps are much better at that too. So, according to your comments about bio filtration being only as efficient as the oxygen level allows, a sump is better at that too.

I think that the only thing that might be better thank a sump is the ultima filters (which are basically large canisters, I know) if the tanks are too big to make a sump very achievable.

I still say, sump all the way!

 

[Bigfishnut]

For what GoldFinger plans to keep, and the size of the tank, a sump is the only proper filtration. It's really that simple. If it was a 55 gallon communty aquarium I'd say it doesn't really matter that much, use what you're comfortable with. Why on earth would someone pay $1500 to $3000 on an asian arowana and not go with a proper sump? Makes no sense. I'm not here to tell people what they want to hear, I'm here to give sound advice. I've been in this hobby for a very long time, and have made costly mistakes. I've grown from them into a very successful fish keeper and I take the time to share my knowledge and experience. I'd rather see someone get it right the first time. If it were simple and easy to keep fish like arowana and FW stingrays, we wouldn't need this forum for experienced fish keepers to share their knowledge with people asking for advice.