God pasionis are gorgeous too. In about a year I plan to be a homeowner where Ill have a 75 for several Thorichthys species. So yes, I was originally thinking I could start the ellioti in the 30--just a pair which i have been eyeing for 3 weeks at LFS while tank cycled--with some dithers. Not looking to overstock. There is one male in there that's about 1.5-2", and 3 others which are much smaller who I think are all females. My parameters are perfect for them. The four of them have been in that tank together since they arrived and whenever I watch them there are 2 that hang together a lot. I think im going to get the dithers established, then stock the pair. If for some crazy reason they balloon into 5" fish in 6 months, the landlady will have to deal! I just want to own them for life you know? And provide the best environment. Not looking to have to get rid of them. And of course, i want them to eventually breed. Thanks for the comparison and encouragement. I think if I get some top-hanging dithers this will cut down on aggression if there is any. Will keep y'all posted.