Really good food for you Flowerhorns

bud

Fire Eel
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Jan 29, 2009
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I just wanted to share this because I know there are a lot of us out there that just can't afford some of the food we see on these flowerhorn websites.I feed small pellets from Kens.The cool thing is it only $18 for 5lbs and a pound will fill a 500gr bottle.Higher in protein and fat than these expensive flowerhorn foods.I feed this to fry as smallas 3/4'' all the way up to my big 12" fish.



KENS PREMIUM SLOW SINKING GROWTH PELLETS 1.5MM: (HIGH PROTEIN & FAT)

THIS SPECIAL FORMULATION IS HIGHER IN PROTEIN & FAT TO PROMOTE GROWTH AND SIZE ON YOUR FISH.
INGREDIENTS: FISH MEAL, DEHULLED SOYBEAN MEAL, CORN GLUTEN MEAL, WHEAT FLOUR, FISH OIL, BLOOD MEAL, BREWERS DRIED YEAST, SOY LECITHIN, YEAST CULTURE, VITAMIN A ACETATE, VITAMIN D3,E,B12, RIBOFLAVIN SUPPLEMENT, NIACIN, CALCIUM PANTOTHANATE, AND OTHER ADDED VITAMINS AND MINERALS.
GUARANTEED ANALYSIS: CRUDE PROTEIN 50.0% MIN., CRUDE FAT 15.0% MIN., CRUDE FIBER 5.0% MAX., MOISTURE 10.0% MAX., PHOSPHORUS 1.2%


[url]http://www.kensfish.com/[/url]
 

RD.

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This is exactly the type of food that you do NOT want to be feeding a flowerhorn.

Part of the problem with FH keepers (and lots of MFK members in general) is they all want to see MAJOR growth in their monster fish, in as little time as possible. While there are many ways to achieve that goal, often times all it results in is a large obese fish, that will eventually die prematurely due to fatty liver, etc. Of course if/when that happens, most hobbyists won't have a necropsy performed to understand why their pet fish suddenly died, they will simply go out and buy another one. (sudden death syndrome anyone?)

IMO this hobby is all about patience, and measuring success in years, not weeks, or months. When it comes to feeding fish, many hobbyists make things much more complicated than they need to be.

I recently posted the following in another thread, and it might be worth repeating here. While the fish used in this study were not FH, they were cichlids, one being a carnivorous species, the other an omnivore. The same info would apply to any & all FH strains.


Feeding high protein, and especially high fat levels to adult cichlids can be a dangerous proposition, even with carnivorous species. (which flowerhorn are not)

The following exerts come from a study overseen by Dr. Ruth-Francis Floyd, a DVM, MS, and a professor at the U of FL that specializes in fish nutrition & health.

The TP diet was comprised of 52% crude protein, and 17% crude fat. The FF diet consisted of 47% crude protein, and 7% crude fat.

The lipid-rich TP diet may be suitable for commercial production of juvenile African cichlids up to 12 weeks of age, but prolonged feeding may result in excess lipid deposition and necrosis of the liver. Feeds like the FF diet, which produced slower growth but lower lipid deposition in livers, may be more suitable as a maintenance diet for cichlids in the home aquarium.
"Fatty infiltration of the liver has also been designated "the most common metabolic disturbance and most frequent cause of death in aquarium fish"
With prolonged feeding of a high-energy, lipid rich diet, degenerative changes of the liver and death can occur unless the diet is corrected.
Now imagine what happens to the liver of an adult CA cichlid/flowerhorn (with much lower metabolisms) when fed diets that contain excessive amounts of lipids. (fat)

The juvie H. ahli (s. fryeri) used in this study faired much better being a carnivore, but it still showed a lipid accumulation in the hepatocytes. (<50%) The P. socolofi had extensive lipid accumulation when fed this TP diet.

This study came about after some cichlid farms in south FL suffered from some large mortalities in both 1998 & 1999. When the dead fish were examined they showed fatty infiltration of the liver, heavy vacuolation, and severe necrosis of the liver, pancreas, and spleen.

It was suggested to the farms that they replace ther feeds with one that had a lower lipid content (less than 10%) and supplement the feed with a vitamin premix. Clinical signs in the affected farms were resolved after implementation of these recommendations.

Fat that is not entirely utilized by a fish as an immediate energy source (which is the main role of fat in a fishes diet) does not equate to all of the excess going directly to growth of a nuchal hump. Most of that excess fat will be deposited in & around the fishes organs, which long term will degrade the health of the fish, and in many cases cause premature death. When I read about the numerous cases of SDS (sudden & unexplained death) in FH I often wonder how many of these cases involved overfeeding, and/or an excess of lipids (fat) in the diet. Unfortunately the vast majority of hobbyists do not have a necropsy performed when their prized fish suddenly dies prematurely, they simply replace it with another fish.

I've been promoting sound husbandry practices (such as limiting a cichlids fat intake) for many years, long before any of the specialty FH foods were on the market. None of this comes as news to me.


While I agree that there is no need to pay some of the ridiculous prices for FH specialty foods, if all one is wanting is a cheap low cost generic farm feed (which IMO is exactly what this is) you would be FAR better off in buying direct from a feed mill, or your local hardware store. It will work out to approx $1 a pound, but will come with the same problems as the food listed by Bud. (excess protein, excess crude fat)

HTH
 
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Camphilophus

Feeder Fish
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Apr 11, 2008
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I like kens products for the money I feed some of this sinking tuff in 70% of my tanks after I feed floating pellets. My goal is that everything gets fed that didn't eat the floating pellets. I think this can be a greasy/messy food if your fish don't eat it but if they eat it your tanks will be fine. It puts on good growth of small fish but I would read RDs post^^. I prefer kens soft and moist with krill sinking food. The ingredients are a little better and if you feed it to your red fish they will get amazing colors from the krill. Its not as cheap but one of the best sinking foods I have used.
 

RD.

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Cam ....... you are in the exact same boat as Bud with Ken's soft & moist with krill.


CRUDE PROTEIN 47.0% MIN., CRUDE FAT 15.5% MIN., CRUDE FIBER 2.0% MAX., MOISTURE 20.5% MAX., ASH 9.0% MAX.


That is not a diet that I would recommend as a staple for any tropical species of fish, for the exact same reasons as listed above. Of course it puts on good growth to young fish, so does generic trout chow, such as the TP diet that was mentioned in my initial comment. But that quick growth comes at a cost to the health of your fish.

Most of these so called "premium" products can be purchased in bulk from feed mills, which is exactly what Ken does, and then simply puts his own label on them. http://www.kensfish.com/kenspellets.html

Check the ingredients closely, do any of the pellets listed in that link look like premium food to you? It's cheap, because it's cheap to make, and VERY cheap when purchased in bulk.

I'm not knocking anyone who feeds these types of foods, nothing personal, I'm just sayin ........
 

Camphilophus

Feeder Fish
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Apr 11, 2008
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I read your post but will continue to feed kens simply because there are just not that many options to chose from with fish food. I feed nls as my staple and kens is fed afterwards. I can usually only afford about 2 kinds of nls at a time so I have to have something else to vary their diet. I have flakes, 4 bit blend, and algae wafers from kens too. I have been feeding about every type of food I can get my hands on to vary my fishes diet and I am pretty much never impressed with anything. I just stick with a good staple and whatever the fish like to eat on the side. I don't worry about my fish getting fat because I only feed them 5 days out of the week and I don't overfeed them.

On another note do you have any good recipes? I have been brewing beer lately and have 20lbs of grain leftover about once a week that I have read you can use to make fish feed. I'm interested in trying some recipes out and using all my leftovers. Most of the time I have 2row grain leftover. I could test it out on local pond/lakefish before my tanks.
 

RD.

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I agree that as long as one isn't feeding these types of food as a staple, it lessens the long term potential for health issues.

I don't worry about my fish getting fat because I only feed them 5 days out of the week and I don't overfeed them.
Excessive fat deposition on a fishes liver doesn't necessarily equate to a fat fish. This isn't something that one can determine by simply eye balling their fish, you need to perform a necropsy, and examine a liver sample under a microscope. Also, most hobbyists aren't overly disciplined when it comes to feeding their fish (sounds like you are) and they tend to overfeed. This just compounds an already potential serious long term health issue, especially when it comes to high protein/high fat diets.


Sorry, I haven't made my own food in over a decade, and when I did it didn't include grain.
 

Psuedofire

Feeder Fish
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Apr 4, 2007
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I get good results too with kens. I mix it with hikari and feed shrimp, salmon, and feed vegies here and there. I like the results. I really don't care if my fh live beyond 5 years. Call it irresponsible if you wish but to me getting emotional over fishes longevity is silly, it's a fish and is replaceable. I like the rapid growth that I get from the bulk fish farm foods. Feeding your fish expensive foods to promote longevity seems like a waste of money to me because there are so many other factors that can kill your pet besides a fatty liver.

Fish keeping is a hobby and not my life, I strive for great looking fish. There is no way you can recreate natural food selection of these fish in a closed system such as a fish tank. Some foods are better than others but the price you pay for that is weighed against the advantages. I don't see having a fish for 20 years as an advantage... Some may argue, judge, and tell others they are wrong for the way they keep fish, but it all comes down to the individual on how they want to feed, how emotional they are, their goals in life, and how much they are willing to spend on the hobby. I think it's funny how some people take fish nutrition more seriously than their own. (post not directed at anyone or critical to how one chooses to feed their pet)
 

RD.

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I really don't care if my fh live beyond 5 years. Call it irresponsible if you wish but to me getting emotional over fishes longevity is silly, it's a fish and is replaceable.
Wanting the best for your fish, including a long healthy life, has nothing to do with emotions.

Certainly how one keeps their fish is up to each individual, no one is holding a gun to anyones head here. I was simply pointing out the potential health issues with the food that Bud was recommending, and also offered a manner in which to feed the same quality food, at a fraction of the price. I would think that someone that feels the way that you do about keeping fish would be all over that.
 
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