Getting my Jurs off live (guppies)

[thebiggerthebetter]

Thank you, T1KARRMANN.

T: I would give it a very big feed of what he likes and make a note of the date then no more live feeders for say 6 weeks but still offer prawn daily frozen de shelled the cheap type.
TBTB: I've been giving them raw shrimp, yes. The last time they saw live feeders (guppies) was in Oct-Nov last year.

T: If after 6 weeks he's still not eating the start again
TBTB: The front one has been taking shrimp well for ~3 months. The one in the back has not had a meal that I'd know of in 5 months. Shows no interest in the shrimp or a few other things I have offered. The front one even took in a sinking pellet yesterday, meant for the irwini. He spat it out but this is significant nevertheless.

T: Also leave some food in the tank over night as that's when they hunt more
TBTB: I have been. The front one cleans it up or sometimes the 5 aros get it. The back one - never AFAI could tell by his tummy (the pieces are large enough to show).

I am pondering moving the aros to a pond and then leaving more shrimp than the front one can handle and then see...

 

[T1KARMANN]

Try throwing the prawn shrimp in frozen as I find with rays the feel of something cold gets them interested

With tigs I have had best results with hikari sinking carnivore

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[gangster]

Stunning jurs! I see where Cicx is saying all FZ's are just jurs. These could classify as fz's. Very nice and keep up the updates.

 

[thebiggerthebetter]

May 20 update. Success at last.

The stubborn jur has taken his first meal after ~6 months of refusal on May 13 2013. I had to dangle a frozen-thawed shiner (a small marine silver fish we catch here) on a thread in front of him for 5-10 min and he went for it. The credit for saving/weaning the fish actually goes to my wife because I almost gave up and she convinced me to try again and try the dangling.

Now looking back, I am not sure why I have not done it sooner. Maybe because the dangling never worked for me before. Well, I was clearly wrong not to try it with this fish and not to listen to those of you who said it had worked for you.

Second shiner was taken the same way two days later - would not pick it up from the bottom (the other one did) but almost didn't have to dangle - after several seconds he went for it.

Third shiner another two days later was taken as soon as it brushed by him and hit the bottom. No dangling. Hopefully this will continue.

First two photos are of the stubborn, thin, nearly emaciated jur that has just started eating. The third pic is of the one that had started taking prepped foods after ~2.5 months of fast without any dangling - he takes shiners, shrimp, other fish pieces, etc. readily and eagerly (neither one takes Zigler's sinking catfish pellets meant for their tankmate irwini):

 

[Chicxulub]

Viktor,

How hard or soft is your water? How big are the fish now? How much and how constant of lighting do they have?

I ask because I noticed while I had my jur in soft, black water, her stripes got noticeably bolder and yellower. For S&G I added carbon to remove the tannins, removed the peat that was softening the water and did a huge water change with some of Missouri's liquid rock. Her stripes immediately faded and haven't come back in the hard water. I'm about to re-soften the water with more peat to see what happens. I can't help but suspect that within a few days her stripes will be back in force.

Thoughts?

 

[thebiggerthebetter]

How hard or soft is your water?
***My well water has ~1400 ppm of TDS, out of which ~600 ppm is Ca and Mg - very hard (actually 300 ppm is considered very hard); the rest is mostly salinity. It runs through an RO, comes out with 30 ppm of TDS. Then runs through a carbon filter and through a calcite filter, which adds Ca and Mg and brings up the TDS to ~120 ppm or so. That's the water the jurs always have been in.

How big are the fish now?
***10" TL.

How much and how constant of lighting do they have?
***No lamps. The room has plenty of natural light. Their tank is by a large window draped by an old comforter so it is never in direct sun light.

Thoughts?
***Interesting. Having not experimented like that and not knowing your hardness/softness #'s, I can only speculate that jurs prefer softer water, which is more like their natural water. They are wide-spread though and adaptable, PCF lists pH 6.4 - 7.2 and temperature 22.0-27.0°C or 71.6-80.6°F. Neither PCF nor FishBase list a hardness range. I'd not expect them to care much for the blackness of water, except, as you hinted, its effect on the amount of light, but PCF states: "A fast muddy water fish." So they should like dark water but probably mud, not so much tannins. Surely, the substrate color matters and, debatably per your threads and others, the fish's origin

 

[thebiggerthebetter]

Forgot to mention that still, neither one would take massivore pellets.

 

[strollo22]

I find it interesting how some Jurs are so finicky. I starved mine for 3 days and it ate shrimp. Fed her shrimp everyday for a week and starved for 4 days and it took massivore. Mine doesn't hunt at all though. If it doesn't him him in the whiskers or the mouth, it won't eat at all


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[yogiso02]

Great read. Will try to do what was mentioned to get my cat to eat frozen


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[thebiggerthebetter]

It's been 4 years.

Both original jurs have been lost to predators in the 1500 gal pond long, long time ago. Jau. Silver aro. That was painful. I thought they could hold their own. They really can't cope well with a predatory attack.

IME, seems like no Brachie can. Lost a tig and a slobbering cat the same way. Also dorado. And almost lost a 20" piraiba the same way. They don't fight back. Daisies.

Guys, don't temp fate with Brachies.

After trying a couple of years, John Kreatsoulas aka snookn21 brought me 10 jurs at 2". As smart as I am I managed to lose one soon thereafter to a hungry pack of 6 GATF.

Here are 9 survivors about 3-4 months later at 6"-8". Interesting that the pattern on one has become quite different from the rest. Still evolving heavily.