Fish Room Redux - 3600+ Gallon Plywood Tank Build

[nolapete]

Garage before and after today's work in it. It doesn't look like much since we had to put everything back in it that we took out that wasn't boxed up yet. We decided to put the 210 gallon tank in the living room instead of the garage, so we're going to paint the stand back. You can see the stand in the back left of the garage.

The 4 blue water containers are going to be plumbed to be canister filters for part of the filtration for the 3665 gallon tank. To give you an idea of their size, they hold 15 gallons each.

 

[nolapete]

Phase 1A - make room in the garage - complete - I'll take a couple pics before I start working on the next phase

Phase 1B - move smaller tanks out of fish room to new locations

I know this part of the build is boring, but I think it is important to document the transformation fo the fish room. I plan to document the fish room, tank, and filtration builds.

The target date for having it up and running with fish in it is April 30, 2009. Not as quick as VLDesign's build, but I have quite a bit more prep work to do.

I'll post a few pics of the current progress later.

 

[nolapete]

Here's my seamed liner idea. I'm still waiting on an email back from a pond liner company to see if it can be done. The Firestone QuickSeam is 6" wide and used to join one liner to another. It clearly indicates that it is not for indoor use, so I'm also waiting for a response as to why that is.

 

[nolapete]

Figured out how to fold the liner so that none of the extra is in the water column. No need to seam it now. I made a paper scale model of it and will need a 20'x25' liner. If I go 45 mil, it will be under $200 and about $300 for 60 mil.

Since the wall shared by the dining room is 11'4", I'm thinking about going with a 4'x10' viewing window instead of 4'x8'. It all depends on if my friend can come through with the deal on the acrylic.

 

[Egon]

Figured out how to fold the liner so that none of the extra is in the water column. No need to seam it now. I made a paper scale model of it and will need a 20'x25' liner. If I go 45 mil, it will be under $200 and about $300 for 60 mil.

Since the wall shared by the dining room is 11'4", I'm thinking about going with a 4'x10' viewing window instead of 4'x8'. It all depends on if my friend can come through with the deal on the acrylic.

Please explain the folding, I'm very interested in this build.

 

[chefjamesscott]

if i could make a recommendation for the extra cost vs the extra thickness you should really go with the thicker best safer now than sorry later

thanks for posting this thread good to see

 

[nolapete]

Ok, here's step by step. Ignore the cuts in the corner. Paper doesn't give any like the liner will in the corners when folded down. There WON'T be any cuts in the liner.

Here's the picture progression:

Liner flat

Long sides folded up

Short sides folded up (notice the triangle formed on each corner)

The difference between corners folded inside (top/normal) and outside (bottom/my way)

Another example of the folded inside normal way on the bottom

The folds on the outside my way between inside of tank and plywood

Clean inside lines with top folded down over the 6" walls of the tank. Notice how the fold is secured in the corners. No folds on the back and front.

The corner folds are sandwiched between the inside liner wall and the plywood. Kind like the inside of a hotpocket. With the amount of water pressure on them, there's no escape.

 

[Egon]

Ahhhh now I get it, thank you. Pics are great.

Okay this brings up another question: I realize there's no cuts so there will be no leaking. Are you sealing/gluing the folds so no water seeps in to the folded area or is this not a concern? I was just wondering if the water gets between the folds maybe there would be some ammonia build up or some other issue that could possibly be bad? Or the pressure from the water squeezes this area down to almost nothing and there's nothing to be concerned about?

 

[MyFishEatYourFish]

Ahhhh now I get it, thank you. Pics are great.

Okay this brings up another question: I realize there's no cuts so there will be no leaking. Are you sealing/gluing the folds so no water seeps in to the folded area or is this not a concern? I was just wondering if the water gets between the folds maybe there would be some ammonia build up or some other issue that could possibly be bad? Or the pressure from the water squeezes this area down to almost nothing and there's nothing to be concerned about?

the way you want to fold is a great idea but the water pressure wil move the folds into the tank leaving you with a dogear in each corner.
also it would form some seriuos creasing that would probably break the liner over time if not quite emmediately.
i would cut the liner in the red cross pattern like shown and thenover cut it so you can squeeze a seam in each corner with some silicone in it. this would seal the tank by itself but as you cannot trust silicone and pond liner i would then seal the inside corner with goop or something that is waterproof and sticks well to the liner.
i think when they say not for household use on the tape they just don't trust it 100% to stop evey leak, since pinhole leaks will never be noticed in most outdoor apps they get away with it. i would cut strips of liner then seal them into the corners like the tap but with globs of adhesive to really make the seal 100% the first time!
good luck man! i'm super jealous and can't wait to see it get started!

 

[nolapete]

I'm thinking that the water pressure will squeeze out the water and air behind it, but this is only a theory. Application is an entirely different thing as we all know. I plan to push out any water and air as the tank is filling.

MyFishEatYourFish, do you think that breaking is really a possibility? Wouldn't the fold break the same way if it was on the inside of the water column? My friend hasn't had that problem with his, but it's inside the tank not behind the interior liner. I'm considering going with the 60 mil liner instead of the 45 mil. It's more, but I want this tank to last and be as trouble free as possible.

I think that I'll try it this way and see what the result is. If the liner behind the interior wall breaks, I can always cut it in the red cross pattern and use the quickseam then use Dow 927 to seal it. It's what my friend uses on the gasket between the liner and the glass on his.

After I get the fish room emptied, I'm going to build a pvc skeleton of the tank and hang plastic or cardboard to test my room dynamics. I don't want to get into real construction and have a logistics nightmare.

Next steps:

Empty Fish Room
Remove Ceiling Fans
Tear Out Ceiling
Raise Ceiling
Install Ventilation Ducts And Route to Roof Power Ventilator
Install Hardware to Suspend Lights and Pully for Raising Them
Sheetrock, Float
Remove French Doors Then Close In Wall.
Install Small Ventilation Windows On Closed In Wall
Remove Baseboards
Tear Out Sheetrock on Front and Side Wall
Move Electrical Outlets Above Tank Height
Build 24" Retaining Wall with Sealed Concrete Board Then Caulk
Create Seal on Door To Laundry Room
Install 3 4" Drains To Outside

Build Tank
Build Filters
Install Liner
Lower Front of Liner and Bring in Front Glass/Acrylic
Raise Liner and Temporarily Secure
Mount Front Glass/Acrylic
Wait Forever and a Day for Dow 927 to cure
Test Fill Tank (Pray Like Crazy It Doesn't Leak)
Drain Tank
Cut in Bulkheads
Plumb Risers on Bulkheads to Tank Height
Refill Tank
Test for Leaks (Pray Again More Than Last Time)
Plumb In Filters
Test Run Primary Filter Subsystems
Watch For Leaks
Add cycled gravel and sand and huge cycled sponge filters
STOCK IT!