I soak the pellets once a week. I think thats fine and not over doing it. Also when i feed beef heart, I inject it with vita chem for more nutritional value.RD.;3647905; said:
Hikari vs. NLS
- Thread starter Biggfeast
- Start date
RD.;3647851; said:
Just making a point, if I sold Fords exclusively, sure I would beat up on GM's. I did not realize there was an ulterior motive for your vehement protests anytime anyboby brings up an alternative prepared food.
Just curious how many folks in this thread knew Neil is acually a vendor for NLS, I guess I was just uninformed.
Good luck on your food sells.
.
And to borrow a phrase from you posted earlier in this discussion;
Six comments later, and you still haven't said anything that adds any substance whatsover to this discussion. Nothing. Talk about showing your true self.
vehement protests?
Perhaps you should brush up on your reading comprehension skills. I honestly don't give a flying flip what anyone on MFK feeds their fish, but I will do my best to correct false or misleading information when I see it being bantered around by those that are lacking a more complete understanding of this subject. If that's somehow a bad thing, then I guess my bad.
I stayed out of this discussion until page 4, and only then posted so as no one would be further confused as to how nutrient levels should not be compared. Please note that I am in no way stopping reps from any other company from adding to this discussion. I would gladly welcome reps from any company to come into a discussion such as this and explain in detail how raw ingredients such as corn flakes, dried bakery products, and MSG add nutritional value to their products. Personally I would love nothing more than to see a LOT more accountability within this industry, instead of everyone wasting their resources & funds on advertising, and marketing. I have no doubt that some of the major manufacturers spend more money on advertising in a single month, than New Life has since their inception, 15+ yrs ago. Who do you think ultimately pays for those full page glossy advertisements in the various trade magazines? Personally I would prefer to see a manufacturer put their money into what matters the most, such as the raw ingredients of their products.
And just for the record, I'm not just a vendor, I'm a wholesale distributor, and only in Canada, and I don't sell to hobbyists. I've got far better things to do with my time than go trolling for new customers on online chat forums. I'm actually surprised that your super sleuthing didn't uncover the fact that I'm also personal friends with the manufacturer, you might want to add that to your little character assassination campaign as well.
But no matter how much you would like it to, none of that changes the facts regarding what I have posted about nutritional matters in this discussion. I discovered a long time ago that when someone has nothing of value to add to a debate, or simply feels defeated, they tend to attempt to make things personal and attack the poster, and not the posts.
You stated earlier on in this discussion that arrogance leads to foolishness, and on that note sir I'm in complete agreement.
Have a nice day.
Six comments later, and you still haven't said anything that adds any substance whatsover to this discussion. Nothing. Talk about showing your true self.
vehement protests?
Perhaps you should brush up on your reading comprehension skills. I honestly don't give a flying flip what anyone on MFK feeds their fish, but I will do my best to correct false or misleading information when I see it being bantered around by those that are lacking a more complete understanding of this subject. If that's somehow a bad thing, then I guess my bad.
I stayed out of this discussion until page 4, and only then posted so as no one would be further confused as to how nutrient levels should not be compared. Please note that I am in no way stopping reps from any other company from adding to this discussion. I would gladly welcome reps from any company to come into a discussion such as this and explain in detail how raw ingredients such as corn flakes, dried bakery products, and MSG add nutritional value to their products. Personally I would love nothing more than to see a LOT more accountability within this industry, instead of everyone wasting their resources & funds on advertising, and marketing. I have no doubt that some of the major manufacturers spend more money on advertising in a single month, than New Life has since their inception, 15+ yrs ago. Who do you think ultimately pays for those full page glossy advertisements in the various trade magazines? Personally I would prefer to see a manufacturer put their money into what matters the most, such as the raw ingredients of their products.
And just for the record, I'm not just a vendor, I'm a wholesale distributor, and only in Canada, and I don't sell to hobbyists. I've got far better things to do with my time than go trolling for new customers on online chat forums. I'm actually surprised that your super sleuthing didn't uncover the fact that I'm also personal friends with the manufacturer, you might want to add that to your little character assassination campaign as well.
But no matter how much you would like it to, none of that changes the facts regarding what I have posted about nutritional matters in this discussion. I discovered a long time ago that when someone has nothing of value to add to a debate, or simply feels defeated, they tend to attempt to make things personal and attack the poster, and not the posts.
You stated earlier on in this discussion that arrogance leads to foolishness, and on that note sir I'm in complete agreement.
Have a nice day.
To be fair, like RD's passion for NLS or not, the facts are the facts. That's why I feed it. No amount of passion is going to dissuade me from determining what's best for my fish, and the science supports NLS.
Touchy, touchy, just a little transparency Neil. It is good for the soul.
Have a great Thanksgiving Neil.
Have a great Thanksgiving Neil.
Well to be perfectly honest reverse this is a touchy subject for me.
And if it appears at times that I am on a crusade of sorts, it's because I am. A crusade that started 30+ years ago, when the pet food industry as a whole needed to be taken to task. Not just fish food manufacturers, but ALL pet food manufacturers. (dog, cat, fish, etc)
I've simply never been one to sit back & accept the fact that certain foods are loaded with low cost fillers, as though a dog is genetically hard wired to consume 5 different variants of corn. (which when combined in many cases make up the main ingredient of the food)
All of the slick marketing & pretty labels in the world won't change that fact.
Today the buzz words in the dog food industry are natural, and organic, with many formulas containing botanicals, probiotics, prebiotics, and exotic protein sources such as venison, duck, beaver, etc. 30 years ago you would have been hard pressed to find more than a couple of formulas containing lamb meat. I welcome these advances with open arms!
This isn't about me taking pleasure in beating up on the competition, it's about me hoping that with enough consumer knowledge, and public pressure (as in consumer demand) that one day ALL pet food manufacturers will be forced to become more accountable, and will eventually clean up their act. Which in the end is in everyone's best interest, no matter what formula or brand they use, or what type of pet they are feeding.
From a sales angle, I'd be better off burning a small candle, and sitting back & enjoying the ride. If you think about this purely from a sales perspective, it's probably not overly business smart for me to be constantly educating the competition, or their customer base.
But this has never been just about business for me.
I personally find it offensive when a fish food manufacturer promotes their abstinence from using low grade fillers of any kind, only to find that every one of their formulas contains soybean meal. Or they market their product as being a Krill formula, when in reality krill is listed as the 6th ingredient by dry weight, with more wheat & soybean meal in the food, than krill. Or those that promote formulas for carnivorous species, only to find large inclusion rates of starch, which carnivores have great difficulty assimilating. Or state that their product is high in stabilized vitamin C, with their reasoning being to help build immunity towards disease, and reduce stress, only to find that the vitamin C content is below what most generic farm feeds contain. (which is typically 150-200 mg/kg)
These types of sales tactics piss me off every bit as much as if I saw a used car salesman taking advantage of a single mom's ignorance of cars. And that's not to say that all used car salesman would do such a thing, so please no hate mail.
Unfortunately doing the right thing tends to cut into the bottom line, and many manufacturers are obviously too busy watching their bottom line, instead of applying the science, raw ingredients, and processing methods that are currently available.
And yes, a little transparency is indeed good for the soul.
Happy Thanksgiving to you & yours.
And if it appears at times that I am on a crusade of sorts, it's because I am. A crusade that started 30+ years ago, when the pet food industry as a whole needed to be taken to task. Not just fish food manufacturers, but ALL pet food manufacturers. (dog, cat, fish, etc)
I've simply never been one to sit back & accept the fact that certain foods are loaded with low cost fillers, as though a dog is genetically hard wired to consume 5 different variants of corn. (which when combined in many cases make up the main ingredient of the food)
All of the slick marketing & pretty labels in the world won't change that fact.
Today the buzz words in the dog food industry are natural, and organic, with many formulas containing botanicals, probiotics, prebiotics, and exotic protein sources such as venison, duck, beaver, etc. 30 years ago you would have been hard pressed to find more than a couple of formulas containing lamb meat. I welcome these advances with open arms!
This isn't about me taking pleasure in beating up on the competition, it's about me hoping that with enough consumer knowledge, and public pressure (as in consumer demand) that one day ALL pet food manufacturers will be forced to become more accountable, and will eventually clean up their act. Which in the end is in everyone's best interest, no matter what formula or brand they use, or what type of pet they are feeding.
From a sales angle, I'd be better off burning a small candle, and sitting back & enjoying the ride. If you think about this purely from a sales perspective, it's probably not overly business smart for me to be constantly educating the competition, or their customer base.
But this has never been just about business for me.
I personally find it offensive when a fish food manufacturer promotes their abstinence from using low grade fillers of any kind, only to find that every one of their formulas contains soybean meal. Or they market their product as being a Krill formula, when in reality krill is listed as the 6th ingredient by dry weight, with more wheat & soybean meal in the food, than krill. Or those that promote formulas for carnivorous species, only to find large inclusion rates of starch, which carnivores have great difficulty assimilating. Or state that their product is high in stabilized vitamin C, with their reasoning being to help build immunity towards disease, and reduce stress, only to find that the vitamin C content is below what most generic farm feeds contain. (which is typically 150-200 mg/kg)
These types of sales tactics piss me off every bit as much as if I saw a used car salesman taking advantage of a single mom's ignorance of cars. And that's not to say that all used car salesman would do such a thing, so please no hate mail.
Unfortunately doing the right thing tends to cut into the bottom line, and many manufacturers are obviously too busy watching their bottom line, instead of applying the science, raw ingredients, and processing methods that are currently available.
And yes, a little transparency is indeed good for the soul.
Happy Thanksgiving to you & yours.
cuban - a lot of that will depend on the fishes genetics. The size of FH's kok is based more on genetics, than diet. The same as an SRT's pearling, and overall color. Short of adding hormones to the food, there are primarily only 2 ways that a fish can be enhanced via its diet, one is to enhance the overall growth of the fish by utilizing high quality highly digestible protein, the second is by enhancing the fishes color via various color enhancing raw ingredients, both natural, and in some cases synthetic. If the vitamin & mineral premix contains more than the quantities generally found in most commercial foods this too can help the fish with its overall general health (especially during periods of stress), but there is no single ingredient that will maximize the size of a fishes kok.
The rest of the hyperbole that one reads is simply marketing.
HTH
The rest of the hyperbole that one reads is simply marketing.
HTH
