My wife and I were amazed by looking at the pics.
Stunning beauty!
Keep pics coming, we'll see what happens.
Stunning beauty!
Keep pics coming, we'll see what happens.
Its been a long time, Oscar, Astronotus rubrocellatus from Rio Negro
- Thread starter ashdavid
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While you have a stuning juvenile fish I'd put $100 that the coloring will change. It may be one of the wild subspecies of astronatus ocellatus, but the overall coloration will change. It's the nature of that family of fish.
I have yet to see any oscar species juvenile pics match their adult pics. I will admit that oscars, like many species of fish available in the fish keeping trade, that wild ones have a much better overall coloration.
The white coloration on the finnage is common. Extremely common. ALL oscars fins have whitish coloration as they grow out unless they are luecistic in which case the fins have a black coloration on the outer edge. The only difference I see here is that the markings are still there on the tail.
I hope the OP enjoys their new oscar.
As far as "new species" being available more in Japan that has to do with more factors than can be easily listed. Just remember that any unverified claims to a new subspecies of a fish are just that. Caveat emptor (Buyer beware).
I'm not an expert on identifying the subtle differences of some fish species as juveniles, but I have raised many oscars over the years. At least the OP won't have to deal with the rampant raging health issues of the commercially bred oscars here in the US.
I have yet to see any oscar species juvenile pics match their adult pics. I will admit that oscars, like many species of fish available in the fish keeping trade, that wild ones have a much better overall coloration.
The white coloration on the finnage is common. Extremely common. ALL oscars fins have whitish coloration as they grow out unless they are luecistic in which case the fins have a black coloration on the outer edge. The only difference I see here is that the markings are still there on the tail.
I hope the OP enjoys their new oscar.
As far as "new species" being available more in Japan that has to do with more factors than can be easily listed. Just remember that any unverified claims to a new subspecies of a fish are just that. Caveat emptor (Buyer beware).
I'm not an expert on identifying the subtle differences of some fish species as juveniles, but I have raised many oscars over the years. At least the OP won't have to deal with the rampant raging health issues of the commercially bred oscars here in the US.
Ahh, so you are the person that your oscar buddy has been talking about.SFury;3059856; said:
No one is saying that the fish will keep its juvy colors, on the contray, but it is said to have very distinct traits that other oscars do not, ie body shape ,patterns and coloration. And I never said that white finnage is rare, but the location that this fish was obtained from is, and it has not been imported from there before.
One thing you should take into consideration about your comment on Japan is that although some people are only after a quick buck there are people in this trade that can be trusted and some people actually go to destinations and collect the fish themselves. Of corse this raises the price of the fish ,but when you are getting what you pay for an have the peace of mind that it is what they say it is it is all worth it. How many times do you see fish in Japan that no where else in the world can ever dream about? Quite often I might add.
Even though you said you are not and "expert" on identification maybe before you "imply" that a fish may not be what it is said to be you should investigate all channels and see if the fish is what it is said to be. I don't know how you would do that, but I suggest you do anyway.
Anyway, there will always be doubters wanting to put something or someone down....
only time will tell how this fish will grow up and i do agree with ashdavid that japanese pay a higher price but also they get better fishes because people do travel to these destinations and pick these fishes up
Could this be a picture of an adult. Color looks pretty close to me as juveniles, just the pattern has changed. I found this picture on the net.
Color and body differs from other wild oscars I've seen. This one seems to be more elongated.
Color and body differs from other wild oscars I've seen. This one seems to be more elongated.
I am not an Ichtyologist. If anyone here is, then please speak up. Although I am a hobbiest, I got my first Oscar in 1973 and have owned many. In 1973, there were only two types of Oscars in the aquarium trade, those being the wild variety of Astronotus Ocellatus (aka the Green Oscar) and the first commercially bred color morph of that species, called the Red Tiger. Red Oscars, Lutinos, Gold Oscars, etc. are all color morphs of A. Ocellatus produced via selective breeding since that time.
A. Ocellatus is also called the Common Oscar. It is of the Family Chiclidae, Tribe Chaetobranchini, Genus Astronotus, Species Ocellatus.
Rarely seen in the hobby is the second Oscar species Crassipinnis, also known as the Fat Oscar or Black Oscar. As far as I know, these have not been bred in captivity and are only available in wild caught varieties. There do appear to be several wild morphs of Crassipinnis, there is considerable variation in adult coloration depending mainly upon where the fish was collected.
A. Crassipinnis was originally described by J. Heckel in 1840. It was mistakenly classified Acara Crassipinnis. It was correctly classified by S. Kullander in 1986 in Cichlid fishes of the Amazon River drainage of Peru.
The fish in the first photo is obviously a juvenile and the adult markings and coloration are thus unknown. However the body shape, fin shape, and the two noticeable rows of raised scales on the side differ from the more common Oscars. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that the fish in the original post appears to be a juvenile Crassipinnis. It may well represent a new color morph not seen before. I gather that it was collected in the Rio Negro. The Crassipinnis species has been collected from those waters before. So tentatively: It is of the Family Chiclidae, Tribe Chaetobranchini, Genus Astronotus, Species Crassipinnis.
In any case the fish is stunning, and the owner should be congradulated for owning a rarely collected species, little known to Science. If these can be bred in captivity that would be a first AFAIK.
As to what can be expected - A. Crassipinnis has never been collected in a specimen longer than about 9.5", and the adults are probably smaller than the common Oscar - but that too is not certain, if you can grow yours larger it would be a new record for the species.
A. Ocellatus is also called the Common Oscar. It is of the Family Chiclidae, Tribe Chaetobranchini, Genus Astronotus, Species Ocellatus.
Rarely seen in the hobby is the second Oscar species Crassipinnis, also known as the Fat Oscar or Black Oscar. As far as I know, these have not been bred in captivity and are only available in wild caught varieties. There do appear to be several wild morphs of Crassipinnis, there is considerable variation in adult coloration depending mainly upon where the fish was collected.
A. Crassipinnis was originally described by J. Heckel in 1840. It was mistakenly classified Acara Crassipinnis. It was correctly classified by S. Kullander in 1986 in Cichlid fishes of the Amazon River drainage of Peru.
The fish in the first photo is obviously a juvenile and the adult markings and coloration are thus unknown. However the body shape, fin shape, and the two noticeable rows of raised scales on the side differ from the more common Oscars. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that the fish in the original post appears to be a juvenile Crassipinnis. It may well represent a new color morph not seen before. I gather that it was collected in the Rio Negro. The Crassipinnis species has been collected from those waters before. So tentatively: It is of the Family Chiclidae, Tribe Chaetobranchini, Genus Astronotus, Species Crassipinnis.
In any case the fish is stunning, and the owner should be congradulated for owning a rarely collected species, little known to Science. If these can be bred in captivity that would be a first AFAIK.
As to what can be expected - A. Crassipinnis has never been collected in a specimen longer than about 9.5", and the adults are probably smaller than the common Oscar - but that too is not certain, if you can grow yours larger it would be a new record for the species.
A quick Google search on the name Astronotus rubrocellatus yields very few results, mostly from MFK. Even fishbase.org has nothing on this "species". I am seeing a lot of attacks directed towards Red O. People calling him a noob or uneducated but I ask you how are you supposed to research an alleged species when there is no information about it? Surely if it has a scientific name than a paper or something has been written describing it but no search turns up this information. I find is skeptical that a new species of Astronotus can be described and the only person who knows about it is a fish keeper in Japan. That said the fish in question is a beautiful specimen and probably wild caught from the Rio Negro I don't believe it is anything new to science and probably one of the two described Astronotus species. Before anyone blasts me over my opinion try looking at it from our perspective and keep in mind that there is nothing wrong with a bit of skepticism.
Edit: Further research has lead me to the name Cychla rubroocellata (Jardine & Schomburgk, 1843) but this is an outdated synonym for Astronotus ocellatus and no longer valid.
Edit: Further research has lead me to the name Cychla rubroocellata (Jardine & Schomburgk, 1843) but this is an outdated synonym for Astronotus ocellatus and no longer valid.
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